The greeny vs. The skweeky

Yesterday I had a chance to play for the very first time with the new O&G army I've been painting. Just a normal pitched battle vs. LM's skaven with 2000 point limit. I didn't have much choise of troops as I have just a tad over 1000 points of rank & file ready.

We used full deployment rules and as I had my wolfboys as an advance force I was able to make the skaven set up first. It also allowed me to designate a flanking force. 

All pictures by me and LM.

The situation after scouting moves and skaven turn 1. The skaven line from bottom to top: beastmasters with giant rats, ally chaos dwarf mortar, clanrats, a jezzail, slaves, clanrats, slaves, ally chaos dwarfs, behind trees a jezzail, stormvermins and scouts.

On the top right behind the trees is the main orc unit of 28 boyz. On the other side of that forest is the orc general and his three troll bodyguards. The light green area marks the orc baggage train. Next the the yellow field is unit of goblin stickas. Then in thin line orc arrer boyz and in deep formation gobbos. Another unit of orc arrers and a goblin chariot are just outside of this picture.

Here´s the end on the long goblinoid line with chariot and arrers facing the giant rats. My mecrenary giant and a orc shaman were sent to flanking action. They would enter on turn 3 from skaven right flank. My plan was to try to hold the center with a weak force and try to crush the flanks with my main units.

 First combat occurred between the goblin wolfboys and stormvermin. I charged with the wolves as I didn´t want them to be shot to pieces by that jezzail and skaven scouts. I also wanted to give time for my orc boyz and general and his trolls to ove in. Gobbos lasted for several rounds though being pushed back multiple times and not winning a round of combat.

To my suprise the skaven center didn´t push hard in the beginning. Only the chaos dwarfs moved forward to counter my boyz and trolls.

The chaos dwarf mortar managed to score a direct hit on gobbos killing 5 and forcing a panic test but the brave gobbos held on.

Gobbos before being mortared.

Gobbos after being mortared.

On the orc far left goblin chariot charged the giant rats and their handlers and managed to push them back.

On my turn 3 the flanking force entered the battle. Mercenary giant stayed loyal to the orcs and was now threatening the skaven right flank. Orc shaman cast a mystic mist on the mortar and the closest skaven clan rat unit.

Around turn 4 our centers started closing on each other. A total of two plague cencer bearers and two fanatics were released clogging the battle field effectively. The cencer bearers decimated 12 goblin stickas and the rest did the only reasonable thing and fled the field. My fanatics fell short of their target but were blocking the slaves pretty effectively.

Goblin stickas after being hit thrice by cencer bearers.

On turn five everything went terribly for the orcs. First both my fanatics died by rolling snake eyes. Then the wolfriders who had fought the stormvermin for so long finally broke. And because of that the boyz mob panicked. Just when everything would have been ready for them to charge the skaven. Then skaven scouts managed to sling shot down a troll and the orc general broke. My right flank vanished in seconds.

At that point more than half of my troops in points value were either killed or running and that was the break point we had agreed on. Orcs and goblin fled the field. The skaven were victorious.

Thank you LM for a good game once again. I´ll be back!

--------------------

This was my first time playing 3rd edition WFB with green skins and I learned a lot.

- Goblins are not as bad as you would think

- Orc arrers are pretty useless as missile troops, I´ll use

them as bow wielding boyz in the future

-  I sould have contested the center with my best troops,

it takes a way too much time to march from the flanks

to get to where the action is

- Don´t expect your orcs to manouver like elves

Animal handlers in 3rd ed. WFB: Skaven Clan Moulder Beastmaster

This part of ´Animal handlers in 3rd ed. WFB´ -series of articles is about Skaven Clan Moulder Beastmasters. It discusses rules, models, tacktics, pictures, links, pro´s and con´s and everything related to Skaven animal handlers. Please click here to find the other arcticles.

WD137 is a very good source of material for skavens including beastmasters as there is a lengthy article by Andy Chambers describing his then new skaven army. Andy´s army includes a pack of rat ogres and another pack with giant rats.

Andy Chambers points out in his article that you could in theory field colossal 48 rat-ogres if you wanted to. I really didn´t understand how he got that number. Eight teams,each with four handlers, each with six rat ogres: 8 x 4 x 6 = 192. But 8 x 6 =48. That could only mean that I´ve been completely wrong with the way how you count how many animal handlers you can have. I always thought that the number on top meant number of packs. And model per unit how many handlers you can have in a single pack. How embararssing - now I have to go back and rewrite parts of three previous articles. Hope no one noticed :D

But it´s always nice to learn something new. And this is yet again a good example of how 3rd edition WFB rules are perhaps not the most comprehensive ones out there.

So infact you can have up to 8 handlers divided in 2-8 units. Each handler can have 2-6 beasts in his control. This way you could build two units of 4 handlers and 24 rat-ogres.

The beast choise is pretty nice with rat-ogres and giant rats that only skavens get. Chaos hounds are powerfull as discussed in dark elf and chaos articles but there must be some mistake with the points per model value. For others the hounds cost 23 but for skaven only 20. Giant wolves are another cause of confusion. Points per model cost is given as 2 which is a lot less than their cost of 8 points in rulebook bestiary. I haven´t seen this corrected anywhere but 2 points per model just can´t be right. The points value should be corrected to 8.

And where are wolf-rats? WFB: Armies tells that they are Clan Moulder creations but don´t appear on skaven army list - anywhere!

What happened to wolf-rats?

The Pariedolia blog knows that: "Wolfrats, oddly, were excised from the army roster as of 4th edition and (besides a brief appearance in the Moulder Hell Pit army list in White Dwarf #310) were only recently re-introduced via Forgeworld and the 8th edition supplement Storm of Magic (infamous for also re-introducing Fimir and Zoats, albeit in a rather limited fashion)."

What I am seeing is that the wolf-rats for some reason never made any further than WFB: Armies bestiary. To make things even more curious Andy Chambers tells in the WD137 article that he is planning on converting some wolf-rats for his army. That would suggest to wolf-rats being a troop choise for skaven but I´m not seeing that in the WFB: Armies.

I would personally allow a skaven player to take wolf-rats as pack beasts. By the description in bestiary they are clan Moulder created creatures and in style much more skaven than normal giant wolves.

Rat-ogres and their handlers by Pete Taylor from WFB: Armies

Citadel did produce a set of handlers and pack creatures. The beast choises were giant rats and rat ogres. They were sculpted by none other than Jes Goodwin.

Skaven beastmaster page from the red famous catalogue of 1991.

Clan Moulder beastmasters were sold in blisters with either rat-ogres or giant rats. There was no giant wolf and chaos hound dedicated set produced. You can always use wolf riders or other wolves and chaos hounds from chaos/dark elf animal handler set if you want to use those.

The C22 skaven handlers sell normally for 3-9€ on ebay. A pack of 6 giant rats should cost you about 15€. Jes Goodwin rat-ogres can be purchased for a price of 16-20€ per model.

MM32 and Citadel goblin wolfboy wolf prises range normally 5-10€ each. In BC2 monster starter set there is a vicious giant wolf model that can be bought for less than 5€. FF69 giant wolf will sell for around 20€ and often comes with an orc rider. For wolves there are many allternatives from different manufacturers. Just google for warhammer wolf and choose the ones you like.

Chaos hounds are usually around 10€ BIN.

There is a Forgeworld wolf-rat set available at a price of £32 for five models.

Forgeworld wolf-rats.

Giant Rats

Rules

A giant rat described here matches pretty well the models that were produced. Rats have good speed and because of venomous attacks great strenght. But their usability is somewhat reduced by their low WS. Propably the best thing about them is their cost - for just 2 points per model they are cheap. The empathy rule is a strange one in my opinion. I can understand it if rats were to act unlead but with a handler whipping them into action I don´t think empathy would really be an option for rats.

If you have read my earlier articles you propably know what I think about mutations. They are a nice addition but should be used with care. But that´s just me - I´m not telling you how run your game. D4-1 - that´s a lot of mutations.

Base size of 25 x 25 mm is nice as they do not take so much room on the battlefield as the 50 x 25 mm mounted collegues.

A big pack of rats from Tales From the Big Board

Tactics

The cost effective way to field giant rats is like Andy Chanmbers says - take maximum number of rats for each handler and divide them into units that support you battleplan. Small units for harrassing flanks, skirmishers or warmachines. Bigger ones for screening action and close combat against chosen targets. If you take the maximum unit size of 4 handlers and 24 rats you can get maximum rank bonuses that will help you against smaller enemy units. And can even take some casualties before you start losing those bonuses.

Rats are not that endurable and you can expect them to take losses from missiles and in hand to hand. Taking a big unit lets you take some damage before rolling for rout/panic. And with skaven handler profile you can expect to fail that roll.

A giant rat unit is propably something you field as expendaple. You sort of expect them to die or run eventually. Therefore I would unneccesarily boost their value by assigning them a character model of some sort. They are cannon fodder, a speed bump or a nuisance to enemy at best - don´t put more points there than is needed to do the job. Four handlers and 24 rats costs you just 86 points. I think that pretty good value for money.

A pair of beastmasters with giant rats. From Orcsbains miniature world.

Giant Rat Pro´s:

Unique to skavens

 Very skaveny

Fastish

S3 + venomous

CHEAP!

Giant Rat Con´s:

Low WS

Low combat endurance

Rat-Ogres

Rules

Strong profile for close combat. Rat-ogres cause fear which is a very good ability. If you win a round of combat and enemy is pushed back he is automatically routed. And when you charge the enemy of he charges your rat-ogres he has to for fear. Mutations are pretty rare as you get maximum of one on a D4-3 roll.

Some rat-ogres and beastmasters from Snickit´s Tail

Tactics

Charge! You want to get your rat-ogres engaged in combat. Their WS is an average 3 but 2 attacks and good strenght will compensate. They are very tough with T5 and W3 but the handlers aren´t. Lucky missile fire can take the handlers out and then your rat-ogres are useless. I would really concider taking a hero to lead them. Both for sustainability and leadership bonus. Rat-ogres are a good substitute for heavy cavalry the skaven don´t have.

Some of LM´s beautiful rat-ogres.

Rat-ogre pro´s:

Great close combat profile

Cause fear

Unique to skaven

Jes Goodwin

Rat-ogre con´s:

Value per model

Vulnerability of handlers

Giant Wolves

Rules

So the rulebook bestiary tells us that giant wolves are almost as large as a horse. Well - the wolfboy wolves are pretty close to metal elven horses so I´m confortable with that. Base size is 25 x 50 mm. The bestiary description says nothing about skaven and points out that giant wolves are riding animals. Perhaps they were originally not thought to be used in a pack of beasts?

Giant wolves must always follow up and pursue as they are difficult to control. Being hungry for combat a unit of giant wolves must charge if they begin their movement phase within charge range of an enemy unit of half it´s size or more. This can be avoided by a 2D6 test versus units LD.

A minor weakness is that the giant wolves fear fire and must make a paniv test if attacked by fire weapons or if they come closer than 4" of a fire.

The point value feels a bit high. They are fast and have WS4 but are they really worth 8 points. Maybe.

Tactics

As wolves are really fast and pretty good in close combat with WS4 you could use them as light cavalry. Threaten flanks, harrash skirmishers and war machines. Just keep in mind that you can only make that one maneuver per movement phase and that a big unit will take quite a lot of space. A small pack of wolves could perhaps be held back to protect you jezzail teams or warp fire throwers. With that M9 you should be able to charge first and buy time for weapon teams to do their work.

Once again T3 and no armor means that this type of pack is vulnerable to missiles.

Three BC2 Vicious wolves and a FF69 Giant wolf by Goblin Lee.

Giant wolf pro´s:

Really fast

WS4

Giant wolf con´s:

No very skaven

Bit pricey

Vulnerability compared to value

Chaos Hounds

I know I´m repeating myself now with chaos hounds. Things saud here have been said in previous articles about dark elves and chaos.

Rules

 

Rules say that chaos hounds 25 x 25mm but models are supplied with 25 x 50mm and propably won´t fit a smaller one less rank up at all on those. The profile is strong for close combat. Chaos attributes can be a curse or a blessing. And in any case should be generated as mentined under GM´s supervision. We don´t want to take the fun away from anyone by some lucky/unluncky rolls before the game has even started. But everything that all players can agree on should be fine.

The points value has to be a misprint and should say 23 as for darkies and chaos.

Tactics

These dogs are deadly in close combat so you want to get them engaged. They are hard to kill with T4 and W2 but will propably draw missile fire as the enemy wants to take out the whelp masters and send the hound on their way to wilderness. Take a hero to lead the unit and concider armoring the handlers.

As chaos hounds are pretty valuable I wouldn´t waste them on harrassing skirmishers or war machines. Like rat-ogres they are a substitute for heavy cavalry so a simple staright forward advance followed by a charge should work. But once again - a large pack takes a lot of space.

A large pack of chaos hounds from Realms of Chaos blog.

Chaos hound pro´s

Nice models

Look good in large packs

Very powerfull in close combat

Good speed

Strong overall profile

Chaos hound con´s

Vulnerability of the handlers

Pricey

Wolf-Rats

Rules

Compared to ´normal´ giant rats wolf-rat have better WS but no venomous attack. They fear fire and are not affected by mutations even though the description says that they are horribly mutated.. Base size is 25 x 50 mm so your unit will become much larger. And they cost more than giant rats.

Tactics

Pretty much the same applies here as for giant rats. Or for wood elf war hound packs that have almost the same profile as wolf-rats. I don´t see much sense in taking wolf-rats if you can field giant rats as rats cost less and can do the same things as wolf-rats.

Pirate Viking Painting blog Forgeworld wolf-rats.

Wolf-rat pro´s:

Unique to skaven

Wolf-rat con´s:

Price compared to giant rats

No oldhammer models available

Lame rules

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